Chat with Steve Rasnic and Melanie Tem
*** (01:57):Welcome to SNUTCH TALK LIVE! ***
ELWilliams.u says (02:00): (Bio taken from The Man on the Ceiling.) Steve Rasnic Tem has been called “a school of writing unto himself” (Joe R. Lansdale). His surreal stories have earned him comparisons to Franz Kafka, Dino Buzzati, Ray Bradbury, and Raymond Carver.
ELWilliams.u says (02:01): Award-winning author, poet, and playwright Melanie Tem is the author of fourteen published novels. Her works have won, among many accolades, the Bram Stoker Award and the British Fantasy Award.
ELWilliams.u says (02:01): Dan Simmons called her “the literary successor to Shirley Jackson,” and readers and reviewers consistently rave about her deeply involved stories of the terrors that haunt families.
ELWilliams.u says (02:01): Together, Melanie and Steve won the Bram Stoker Award for their multi-media collection Imagination Box, and won a Stoker, International Horror Guild and World Fantasy awards for their novella “The Man on the Ceiling” (the only work ever to win all three).
ELWilliams.u says (02:01): They live in Denver, Colorado with the family they have made for themselves. -Bio
kdespins.u says to (02:03): Our writing group is currently attempting collaborations, and I’m finding it more difficult than I expected. What’s your process for collaborating together?
tems.u says to (02:05): s- depends on the story. sometimes one of us starts and just hands it over. sometimes we have a more formal understanding. but for the most part we try to make it improvisational, like two musicians playing off one another and (after editing) it seems to work out.
tems.u says to (02:06): m-sometimes our collabs are sort of dialogs where one of us takes one pov character and the other takes the other. other times we’re going for a 3rd voice and we want it to be a seamless narrative when done.
kdespins.u says to (02:07): sounds like it kind of depends on what the story demands. Right?
tems.u says to (02:09): s- yes, always go with the story. but to be more specific, let the characters tell you what needs to happen or be said next. they are the only true experts in this process. m- i would add though that sometimes we have a sense of the rhythm or tone of the story itself before we start. so it may be that we know from the beginning that the story will go back and forth between two characters, or that it will be all of a piece.
Sam W Anderson.u says to (02:12): Melanie, you’ve spoken before about your thoughts that a story doesn’t necessarily need conflict resolution to still be a whole story…can you explain your thoughts on that, and Steve, do you agree with Melanie’s assessment?
tems.u says to (02:14): m-i think this is probably my profound distrust of rules as they are said to apply to art. tell me that a story has to have conflict and i will almost instinctively resist that dictum because i think writing like other forms of art has to be able to work outside rules and expectations.
tems.u says to (02:15): s- i think it’s hard to make a story interesting without conflict resolution, but it can be done. all a story really has to be is an interesting narrative, however you get there, conflict or illumination or mystical revelation or mystery uncovered, whatever.
tems.u says to (02:18): m-in my playwriting group a similar question comes up periodically. one of the group members insists that some things are “plays” and some things are just “things on stage.” similarly, i think statements like “a story has to have conflict” often arise out of a need to define what a story is as different from “just a thing on a page” i don’t have that need.
Sam W Anderson.u says to (02:19): Melanie – you rebel against authority, you – When you write these stories, do you have much success actually selling them, or do you get more resistance from editors – and do you think that’s a product of your reputation (sales I mean)?
Sam W Anderson.u says to (02:19): I mean, do you think you could get away with it early in your career before you built your success?
tems.u says to (02:20): m- i don’t know, honestly when I’M WRITONG I DON’T THINK CONSCIOUSL;YVERY much about the building blocks of the story unless it isn’t working and i have to take it apart and rebuild it.
tems.u says to (02:22): m- look at the work of amy hempel. sam and kim have heard me rave about her before. some of the stories in her recent omnibus collection are a page or less and i’d be hard pressed to identify actual conflict and much of what she writes i find brilliant.
tems.u says to (02:23): s- what editors are looking for, remember, is to be surprised, startled, and moved. do that and they won’t have time to think about whether you’re breaking the “rules” or not.
tems.u says to (02:24): m- and Sam, i don’t think it’s so much that i rebel against rules and authority in writing and elsewhere as that i tend to be oblivious to them until someone else calls them to my attention.
Kurt Dinan1.shocklinesforum says to (02:27): Melanie, you just mentioned being oblivious to the rules. That seems to play a big role in the success of The Man on the Ceiling, which seems to really blur the line between fact and fiction. Yet, the book presents itself as “Everything we’re about to tell you here is true.” So am I right in assuming that The Man on the Ceiling is more than just a character for you? How have people responded to it? And have you had to explain any blurring of the line between fact and fiction to your family?
tems.u says to (02:31): m- everything we told you in tmoc is true, not necessarily factual. i know that can sound flip, and in a sense it is a way of having to answer specific questions about specific things in the book (which sometimes works!) we had permission from our kids before we started the book to write about them but by the time it came out at least some of them claimed to have forgotten all about the project and about giving permission.
tems.u says to (02:31): s- they also always forgot their homework.
tems.u says to (02:32): s- part of what we tried to do in TMOC was to write a book about those questions, and have each reader answer that for him or herself.
Kurt Dinan1.shocklinesforum says to (02:33): It’s such an emotional book though, did it just exhaust you writing it? I know when I finished it I was just worn out! 
tems.u says to (02:34): s – there are parts i still can’t read in public, and yes, when it was done i felt as if i had nothing left to give.
tems.u says to (02:35): m- for me it wasn’t only the emotion, it was also the artistic risks. a lot of the time it felt like working without a net.
tems.u says to (02:36): s- but at the same time i felt our solutions to the narrative issues raised felt inevitable, as if we’d worked them out beforehand when for the most part we hadn’t.
Sam W Anderson.u says to (02:38): It’s such a personal book – was there any reluctance to share it to a wider audience? And after doing so, did you feel any release – kind of like “we’re all out there now?”
tems.u says to (02:40): s – for the original novella, yes, but by the time we got to the novel we knew that was the mission, and that we’d have to go even further than we had in the novella. at the same time, it was a writing opportunity we just couldn’t pass up. any time you have a chance to lay down your testimony as to how it was for you to be alive during your time on the planet, you’ve got to take it.
ELWilliams.u says (02:41): How hard are you both on yourselves when you edit? Anything specific you look for to cut? And how hard are you on each other? Does the paper look like a bloodbath when you’re both done?
tems.u says to (02:44): m- almost always, whether i’m editing my own stuff or steve’s or somebody else’s, i find what a member of the northern colorado writers’ workshop used to call “weedy words” (i don’t remember anything else he ever said, but that was a good one). almost always, too, there are funny little tics that show up in one manuscript that may not turn up in any others by the same writer–the same word used 3 times in the same sentence, for examp0le, and then again 3 sentences later.
tems.u says to (02:46): s- it’s the same for me, really, we get lazy, we fall back on easy expressions, and we lose the originality that resides naturally in our characters. i find that if i let my characters talk (or think) i’m usually okay. if I do the thinking for them, i often get off track, become inauthentic, and the prose shows my discomfort.
tems.u says to (02:47): m- i do have to say that as an editor i give a lot more “goods” and “nices” and “wonderfuls” than Steve does.
tems.u says to (02:49): s- Melanie is a better teacher than I am. I tend to find mistakes, off the track moments, inauthentic and inaccurate writing, and I flag those, and forget sometimes how very good the piece actually is.
tems.u says to (02:50): m- he’s sort of of the school that one upon a time long ago he said something i wrote was great and until he says otherwise i should assume that’s still in effect.
tems.u says to (02:50): m- well, that’s efficient, isn’t it?
kdespins.u says to (02:50): so you have to have a good memory?
kdespins.u says to (02:50):
tems.u says to (02:50): s- sorry, last line from me.
tems.u says to (02:51): m- i guess!
kdespins.u says to (02:53): How do you strike a balance between your writing and your non-writing life (e.g., family) without feeling something is getting shorted?
tems.u says to (02:56): m- for us as for many other people, such as many of you, it isn’t even just a balance between writing and family. we’ve both also had day jobs most of the time, and all the other things that take up time and energy. for as long as i can remember i’ve refused to believe that i couldn’t have it all, so i’ve found ways to have most of it, at least. since the kids were little i’ve been getting up at 4 o’clock to write and that’s worked well for me though it does play havoc with a nightime social life.
tems.u says to (02:58): s- i have an invisible day once a week and that helps–no one can bother me then, and i sometimes write 20 hours that day. but i’m constantly frustrated, because i want to be a painter, animator, many other things.
tems.u says to (02:59): m- another trick is to learn to use the opportunities to write that come up during the course of a day like lunch breaks at work, bus rides, etc. the same idea as power naps.
Kurt Dinan1.shocklinesforum says to (02:59): good advice there, although I still struggle with it
kdespins.u says to (03:00): Do you write every day? I find that I think about a story a lot longer than it takes me to write it. Then I feel bad for not writing every day.
tems.u says to (03:01): s- i work on multiple projects–i move between them when the next scene isn’t ready to write yet. we both write every day, even if it’s just a paragraph.
ELWilliams.u says (03:02): So, how mad were you two when WotC cancelled their novel line?
tems.u says to (03:03): s- surprisingly not mad, because i didn’t see us staying with them long term, but seriously disappointed that our two solo novels won’t be coming out next year as planned.
tems.u says to (03:04): m- especially now that the publishing industry is being affected by the economic woes, and our agent says editors are keeping their heads down and not buying anything.
ELWilliams.u says (03:04): With the economy going down the gutter comes the failure of markets. Publishing seems to be especially hit hard, with the folding of many small markets, reduction in pay rates, and laying off workers at big houses. I know the economy rides a sine wave but this time seems to be worst than most other downturns…
ELWilliams.u says (03:04): If the consumer cuts back more than they already have, do you think publishing as we know it today will survive? Or will it go through a new evolution toward more on-demand, pay-as-you-go formats like television is? I know, a loaded question.
ELWilliams.u says (03:05): Could you tell I had this written already?
tems.u says to (03:07): s- i hope not, because i like books the way they’ve always been. alternative formats are going to make inroads, but i think it’ll be many years before we’ll see a significant change in the basic model. but i’m no sf writer, and am a terrible predictor of things, so who knows? i’m just glad to be here.
kdespins.u says to (03:09): Do you have any tricks for getting unstuck (I tried and got nothing on the toilet prompt)?
tems.u says to (03:11): s- tell yourself that you’re going to witness the solution to your writing problem some time in the next trip away from the house. it’ll be in the street, in a store, or in an office, or just something you overhear. but it will be there.
kdespins.u says to (03:11): I’ll try that
tems.u says to (03:14): m- i don’t have any suggestions for when a prompt or an anthology theme or somebody else’s suggestion for a story doesn’t go anywhere for you. i mean, not everybody finds the mystery of how the toilet in the bookstore where our writing group meets was broken all that inspiring. i have lots of suggestions though for getting unstuck in a more general way, though i don’t think there’s ever been a time in my life when i couldn’t write.
kdespins.u says to (03:15): I’m pretty generally stuck right now. Seems like every story is stalled
Sam W Anderson.u says to (03:16): Aside – Kim, I believe that’s because you’ve taken such a leap upward recently – now your more afraid to write something that doesn’t live up to your new standard
Sam W Anderson.u says to (03:18): You both write really smart stories yet have been generally labeled as horror writers – do you think this label has adversely affected your careers in any way?
tems.u says to (03:19): m- i have no idea what effect it’s had on my career, but i don’t like being labeled anything. see? more rebelliousness.
tems.u says to (03:22): s. who can say? no way to tell, really. it gave me as place to sell stories, and i am interested in the dark side of experience. but genre is like religion–everybody has rules and they don’t like to see you break them, or to turn your back on your religion. but i’ve always believed the path to truth and authentic spiritual experience is a personal, individual one, outside the teachings of gurus, critics, even writing instructors. the same is true of genre–be your own religion, your own genre.
tems.u says to (03:22): m- what!
tems.u says to (03:23): m- i don’t get to tell the folks in my writing class what’s real and true?
Sam W Anderson.u says to (03:24): Thanks, the both of you
kdespins.u says to (03:25): Thanks so much for chatting with us
tems.u says to (03:25): s- sure thing. thanks for having us.
ELWilliams.u says (03:25): Yes, thank you for putting up with our antics
Sam W Anderson.u says to (03:25): And I’m so proud of us – two chats in a row without one fucking “f” bomb
ELWilliams.u says (03:25): Nice
tems.u says to (03:25): m- it’s been fun. thanks
Sam W Anderson.u says to (03:25): we’re like adults
kdespins.u says to (03:25): fuck yeah!
Sam W Anderson.u says to (03:25): but different
ELWilliams.u says (03:27): Thanks again
tems.u says to (03:27): s and m- thanks, goodnight
